Can a Gri-Gri work if the cam is prevented from engaging?
Based on comments on this question. If the moving cam on a Gri-Gri is prevented from engaging (perhaps by a belayer firmly holding onto the device), can you still brake effectively?
By "brake effectively", I mean:
- use the traditional brake position with your right hand pulling down on the rope
- arrest a lead fall of a few meters by an average sized climber on dynamic rope, with a comfortable margin of safety
- not just by letting the cam re-engage
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2 answers
Technically speaking, no. For a Grigri to work, the cam must engage, so asking if it works when the cam does not, the answer is: no.
Can it be used to belay? Yes, but it will be more difficult on falls than an ATC.
The sharp angles of the rope going through an ATC provide the friction to ease controlling the rope. The strength required to stop a fall can be managed by the angle of the rope from the feeding side. The sharper the angle, the less strength is required to keep the rope from moving. The Grigri is smoothed around the edges. The rope cannot generate friction as easily and the smoothed 'corners' make it difficult to create a sharper angle that the carabiner normally would with an ATC setup.
The pulley system would still be in place so it would be easier than simply holding the free hanging rope, but it would not be as effective as an ATC.
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From my experience, NO.
My only experience using a few different Gri-Gri devices was during my beginners course last year.
I have however used figure 8 belay devices for years at scouting and that's what I thought of when pulling back on the little levers.
You do NOT want to stop a big fall with that setup (learned from experience with small falls). Just to make it extra clear: I do not recommend using a figure 8 for belaying - do not belay using a figure 8!
Belaying with a broken, or fully pulled back Gri-Gri is most comparable to belaying with a single smooth rope going trough a figure 8 in the 'low friction rope position'
Simply said, this is why i'm scared of Gri-Gri's.
In my opinion they take way too much work out of the belayers hands and will put way too much work back into their hands on complete failure or user error.
Edit:
Looking at the rope routing trough a Gri-Gri it looks comparable as well. (The image of course shows a normally functioning and locked device but we're ignoring that here)
This post was sourced from https://outdoors.stackexchange.com/a/22684. It is licensed under CC BY-SA 4.0.
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